tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post5060045645060024846..comments2024-02-22T02:15:01.912-08:00Comments on The Narcissistic Continuum: Extraordinary, Productive and Exaggerated Narcissism: the Twilight between Healthy and Pathological CZBZhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comBlogger36125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-12288617349621635622013-09-13T05:21:03.360-07:002013-09-13T05:21:03.360-07:00Hi CZ! I've had some very recent experience w...Hi CZ! I've had some very recent experience with a 'productive narcissist' who is running for political office here. She's ALWAYS running for some political office, term after term. And IF she wins, they fear giving her the keys to the bathroom. she is a political joke here.<br /><br />She came for coffee last week, and for some unknown reason, she only did this because she thinks I have more political power here on this side of town than I do....I have retreated from all public life and don't want any power. Period. She lied to my face on a number of things, and had no problems doing so, though I knew the truth because 4 years ago she sat here and told me what she was going to do. "Oh, someone was really spinning my views."<br /><br />LOL! Narcissists rarely take credit for anything, especially when they can blame 'others'. <br /><br />But I knew her (sort of...over 20 years...) and she sent me some God-Awful paragraphs for me to work into a blog entry. They were terrible. She presented herself as a Nazi-Valkyre. Not that she realized it, but the narcissism, the ego, the 'consistantly positive self' was entrenched to such an extent, that it made me gag. I wrote back and immediately told her that I WOULDN'T use this campaign garbage, and she really should reconsider what she was putting out there about herself. Hah!<br /><br />She asked me for copy of my blog entry...the stupid cow was too lazy to go to my blog and read. I refused. <br /><br />I think these 1% ers are so lazy, so used to other people doing things for them, that if they could they would hire a person to wipe their butts. <br /><br />This is a middle aged woman who is very wealthy and she just perpetually runs for any position...dog catcher will be next. It's all about the gaze of the public turning her way, and frankly??? There is no substance to her campaign 'promises' at all. All wind. She has no humility at all. She drives and older car in our neighborhoods (not rich...poor and working class) when she wants our votes, but I am told by her neighbor she has a new Mercedes in her garage. LOL!<br /><br />And her campaign promises haven't changed at all in 20 years. She is like a broken record. It's all ego and opportunism.<br /><br />Lady NyoAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-50488988331621619462013-09-06T20:20:08.344-07:002013-09-06T20:20:08.344-07:00I will read this in the morning...thanks for the t...I will read this in the morning...thanks for the tip!CZBZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-70080823465481184632013-09-06T20:19:15.225-07:002013-09-06T20:19:15.225-07:00Hi Paulette!
It's baffling when someone maint...Hi Paulette!<br /><br />It's baffling when someone maintains a consistently positive self no matter what crimes and misdemeanors they've committed. The situations we assume will teach them a little humility, never do. They remain as certain as ever, as dedicated to their 'vision' as ever. However, we never get emotionally close to these people, they remain enigmatic. Fun to be with but there's not a whole lot of depth to their emotions. I'm thinking a lot of politicians fall into this group.<br /><br />And then we have the "unproductive narcissists", the ones whose narcissism fails them. They go from King-of-the-World to A-Victim-of-Life and anyone else they can blame. ha! <br /><br />Thanks for stopping by!<br /><br />Hugs,<br />CZCZBZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-20774009452321390882013-09-06T12:41:40.223-07:002013-09-06T12:41:40.223-07:00Great post! My only comment is this:
Productive Na...Great post! My only comment is this:<br />Productive Narcissism<br />"A narcissist may be either productive or unproductive. The difference is that the most productive narcissists, the ones who do change our world, have the charisma and drive to convince others to buy in to their vision or embrace a common purpose. They communicate a sense of meaning that inspires others to follow them, whereas the unproductive types retreat into their own world and blame others for their isolation." ~Michael Maccoby"<br /><br />A 'fling' I couldn't shake for over a year is the former, and my mother and ex-husband are the latter....?!? So I get it!!MissPaulettehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17690699918123277732noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-85754855723970699122013-09-04T04:41:38.798-07:002013-09-04T04:41:38.798-07:00Hi CZ, here's an interesting article I got fro...Hi CZ, here's an interesting article I got from your link below, Mad in America, on narrative, language, and the linguistic impoverishment of the DSM-5:<br /><br />http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/anzf.1012/full?dmmsmid=77347&dmmspid=23260945&dmmsuid=2058040<br /><br />You'll find it interesting. xx CSCalibans Sisterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04817489284771105048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-4094881901754692822013-09-03T04:41:54.872-07:002013-09-03T04:41:54.872-07:00Yeah well for every erudite affectation I have, I ...Yeah well for every erudite affectation I have, I can always muster my inner village-idiot! I did have a good weekend, hope you enjoyed your visitor!Calibans Sisterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04817489284771105048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-91803085010079383902013-09-02T20:14:31.824-07:002013-09-02T20:14:31.824-07:00ha! I not only liked your song exaggeratedly-with-...ha! I not only liked your song exaggeratedly-with-a-plus, I loved your song! We had a drop-in visitor with only a couple hours notice which meant vacuuming and changing bed sheets and running to the grocery store and all the things we do when someone stays overnight! I'm finally back in my office!<br /><br />As far as the graph goes? It's almost finished. I don't know why it's taking so long getting this thing on the blog. It's one thing after another and before you know what's happened, it's been a year. Or two. Or three. haha!<br /><br />Hope you enjoyed the Labor Day week-end, CS! <br /><br />Love<br />CZCZBZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-76033359305182055892013-09-01T15:47:04.163-07:002013-09-01T15:47:04.163-07:00Wassamatta U? Don't like my song? Not a Jimmy...Wassamatta U? Don't like my song? Not a Jimmy Cagney fan?<br /><br />me neither. xoxox CSCalibans Sisterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04817489284771105048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-50428833575399581602013-09-01T04:16:53.574-07:002013-09-01T04:16:53.574-07:00Sung to the tune of Yankee Doodle Dandy:
I'...Sung to the tune of Yankee Doodle Dandy:<br /> <br />I'm just waiting on a newwww graph,<br />Posted by my friend CZ...<br />A real smart lady with a master brain,<br />Making a new graph to seeeeee....<br />Dooon't know why it isn't up yet,<br />Buuut I know it's coming soon.<br /><br />CZBZ has a graph she's workin like a MoFo,<br />This nerd is eager like a loon. Calibans Sisterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04817489284771105048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-5585669855454251952013-08-11T03:55:47.825-07:002013-08-11T03:55:47.825-07:00Yeah, I'm a big time nerd. :-) Looking forwar...Yeah, I'm a big time nerd. :-) Looking forward to that graph! watch those steps or soon you'll be running up and down the bleachers at the stadium. Your nephew is lucky to be getting such TLC day in and out. love CSCalibans Sisterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04817489284771105048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-31509825266328264632013-08-10T12:26:00.386-07:002013-08-10T12:26:00.386-07:00Hi CS,
My nephew is doing as well as can be expec...Hi CS,<br /><br />My nephew is doing as well as can be expected, thanks for asking (and I'm getting some much-needed exercise carrying food up and down the stairs, ha!)<br /><br />I'm so GLAD you appreciate Ronningstam's book. I referred this book to forum members many years ago and learned a valuable lesson. The lesson is: just cuz I like a book, doesn't mean other folks will. ha! Ronningstam's research was MORE information than most people cared to read and a couple of folks thought it was "irrelevant" to recovery---an unnecessary exercise in mental masturbation. I could go on and on with people's reactions, most of which were valid criticisms! <br /><br />But since you're rather "nerdish" yourself (grin) and you value academic/clinical research even more than myself I'd reckon, I dared recommend Ronningstam's book knowing you wouldn't call me to task for dwelling in an ivory tower.<br /><br />Until a few prominent social psychologists started writing about narcissism as dimensional and 'normal', I had the Clinical definition figured out pretty well. Narcissism is a complex topic and while layfolk (like myself) are frequently criticized for ATTEMPTING to understand something as complicated as NPD, I believe this is a foolish and proprietary notion. Everyone has narcissistic behaviors that thwart the relationships we yearn to create/maintain so leaving research and explanations and understanding up to the professional community is just downright stupid. And arrogant on the part of the psychologist's contempt for layfolk and layfolk's refusal to examine their own behaviors that might (just "might") be causing problems for other people (and themselves).<br /><br />P.S. I got out my old graph from 2010 and added "Extraordinary/Productive Narcissism" which was the missing element. I'll finish it soon and post it on my blog. I had intended creating an information depot of sorts on webofnarcissism.com but will likely scrap that project. Psychologists and therapists have responded to public demands and they're now providing much-needed information and support to the general public. People like myself "helped" as much as we could until professionals got up to speed. At least that's how I'm seeing things today.<br /><br />Sending some love your way,<br />CZCZBZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-40918240495028195322013-08-10T09:48:10.085-07:002013-08-10T09:48:10.085-07:00Hi CZ, how's nephew doing? btw, Ronningstam&#...Hi CZ, how's nephew doing? btw, Ronningstam's book is giving me the first truly lucid mirror into my own narc fleas that I've had yet. I'm making connections left and right. Maybe the timing was just right, who knows? But her sections on affect dysregulation, and especially regarding reactivity to slights, is speaking to me. This is my biggest flea, as you know, given my background; what I"m learning, is that this flea has the potential to be its own entire area of narcissism. Important to realize. Really important. I'm really grateful you wrote this column. love CSCalibans Sisterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04817489284771105048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-34027332055351292362013-08-07T13:17:51.594-07:002013-08-07T13:17:51.594-07:00Halfway through the Ronningstam and it's a gre...Halfway through the Ronningstam and it's a great resource. I can see why it's your number one 'go to.' It's super clear, and she has so many passages that are just dead on. She also acknowledges how many variables can complicate straight up diagnoses; but her breakdown of categories and overlap is pristinely done.Calibans Sisterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04817489284771105048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-65967443637019334722013-08-07T04:23:11.522-07:002013-08-07T04:23:11.522-07:00Morning CZ, how is your nephew's pain this mor...Morning CZ, how is your nephew's pain this morning? Is he able to walk around at all? Keep your friends posted, here or elsewhere, becuz we worry about our friend in the apron. Sending love to you and your household. CSCalibans Sisterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04817489284771105048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-90808879117181208772013-08-07T03:58:42.684-07:002013-08-07T03:58:42.684-07:00So sorry to hear about your nephew's fall. Hop...So sorry to hear about your nephew's fall. Hope he'll get better soon. <br /><br />Lots of love,<br /><br />Kara xxKarahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14470007362954479373noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-6119814472452673912013-08-06T09:39:37.353-07:002013-08-06T09:39:37.353-07:00This is such scary news about that fall; he is so...This is such scary news about that fall; he is so lucky there was no skull or brain injury (thank god for 'hardhats'). I hope others will help you be nursemaid--his injuries sounded pretty extensive to me, and he will need help moving around. Don't want you throwing your back out again (you just got over last week's spasm!). I finally took on the task, immensely depressing, of typing out my mother's handwritten letter from 2010. It's up on CS. God it was awful typing it but I'm glad it's done and eager to hear what people see in it that I may have missed. She's the biggest depressogen in my life, by far. To communicate endlessly and get nowhere. Calibans Sisterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04817489284771105048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-6472122123985963152013-08-05T22:37:40.397-07:002013-08-05T22:37:40.397-07:00Ronningstam has been my number one "go to&quo...Ronningstam has been my number one "go to" book for understanding the narcissistic personality. She also edited a book titled "Disorders of Narcissism: Diagnostic, clinical, and Empirical Implication" if you're interested in theoretical essays by other clinicians (not just Ronningstam). <br /><br />I'd love to talk with you about book when you've finished reading it! I'll take it upstairs with me tonight and re-read the highlighted sections, the dog-eared pages, the sticky-noted paragraphs. It's a good book to review every now and then. <br />CZBZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-61127633143861994802013-08-05T22:11:36.551-07:002013-08-05T22:11:36.551-07:00Yaya! Another nerdie-type friend who's excited...Yaya! Another nerdie-type friend who's excited about a narcissism graph!! It's nice to know I'm not alone in this world. ha!<br /><br />My nephew fell at work today and fractured his back (he'll be okay!) but I'll be his nursemaid for the next two weeks. That means either: 1) I'll be preoccupied and unable to finish the graph; 2) I'll have free time to finesse the graph since we're stuck in the house and can't go anywhere. <br /><br />He is in a lot of pain but the doctor said his fractures (four) shouldn't result in a disability (thank goodness, since my nephew works in construction). <br /><br />Love<br />CZ CZBZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-13237814649221509352013-08-05T14:13:33.384-07:002013-08-05T14:13:33.384-07:00Yes, I'm afraid I do know people like that. It...Yes, I'm afraid I do know people like that. It's just like you've described it: that feeling of emptiness after having spent time with them doing something that, in theory -or on paper, sounded like fun, and thinking something must be wrong with me...<br /><br />How are you getting on with the chart? I can't wait to see it :)<br /><br />Love,<br />Kara Karahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14470007362954479373noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-20248857026779080522013-08-05T12:59:40.711-07:002013-08-05T12:59:40.711-07:00Hi CZ, I"m reading Ronningstam's book now...Hi CZ, I"m reading Ronningstam's book now; I find it extremely helpful having all the different clinical, psychiatric and professional approaches to narcissism collated and presented as she has done; I also find that I can see my NP in most of the different approaches she outlines; which means that even in competing theories there must be some kind of connecting thread, which she lays out. It's very "detached," yes; but nonetheless, it's useful reading for me. She does tend to downplay how rare it is that people with NPD, if they're not suicidal or medically compromised, present themselves for therapy. Partly because all they have to go on is what they "observe" in clinical studies, case studies, etc. Saving my hands a bit today, but wanted to let you know I've started in and am glad you brought it to my attention. I had not heard of her before your great post. love CSCalibans Sisterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04817489284771105048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-76235545414127115102013-08-02T03:31:47.581-07:002013-08-02T03:31:47.581-07:00She's not a fantastic speaker. :-)
Teaching so...She's not a fantastic speaker. :-)<br />Teaching someone else's program would've been admitting someone else HAD a program.Calibans Sisterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04817489284771105048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-50534881846693287402013-08-01T15:57:46.208-07:002013-08-01T15:57:46.208-07:00I'm sure she saw herself as a guru and expecte...I'm sure she saw herself as a guru and expected people to line up at the doors. That doesn't mean she might not be a fantastic speaker with lots of good things to say; but it's like she "skipped" the hard part earning her credentials. Even slogging along teaching someone else's program would have given her enough credibility to start her own program. <br /><br />CZBZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-54629959586362213302013-08-01T15:17:23.221-07:002013-08-01T15:17:23.221-07:00ps Now picture me with my Daffy Duck imitation: s...ps Now picture me with my Daffy Duck imitation: she'sth desthpicableCalibans Sisterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04817489284771105048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-14551511346817240412013-08-01T15:16:26.407-07:002013-08-01T15:16:26.407-07:00Tell me about it. It was my sister's idea, to...Tell me about it. It was my sister's idea, to run ads for the seminar with a kind of ghostbuster bullseye saying "Sold Out." My mother told me about this gleefully. Then she'd cry to me about why no one is enrolling in her seminars. "People just aren't ready to hear what I'm trying to teach them," she'd weep bitterly. Meanwhile, I'm thinking "people aren't willing to shell out $$ for someone with no credentials, when there are others who really DO have the training and bona fides who are offering something even better." Of course, I'd nod in agreement. Until one day, about seven years ago, I said "hey Mom, instead of crying about your seminars not enrolling, why don't you write the material up in a book? That way you're not just waiting for people to come to you." She took me up on it. Without any acknowledgement of course!!Calibans Sisterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04817489284771105048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-91228854494698508342013-08-01T15:12:09.735-07:002013-08-01T15:12:09.735-07:00ps Hubris is the perfect word. It's always bee...ps Hubris is the perfect word. It's always been there. She's always thought herself an extraordinary person. She used to say, in a kind of breathless voice, ALL the time: "I don't know yet what I'm meant to do; but I'm waiting for it to reveal itself to me. EST, Course in Miracles, Crystals, BULLSHIT. And now the hubris. I do think she knew there would be blowback with the plagiarism. She turned down communication stream to drip drop in the month that led to my finally calling her out on it. And tried to sneak the book out w/o my even knowing about it. Beeaaaatch. She's the kind of person who IS trying to sell products. Pamphlets and cliched workbooks disguised as "from the heart" advice life coaching books. Once she mailed me a letter, in an envelope she'd customized for her (fictional) "company." After the title: "Empowering women through Education." It should have read "Marketing myself through Bullshit." Then she had to chuck the envelopes when she learned there's an actual foundation (Jill Biden is involved) with that logo. Jeeeezzzuuusss.Calibans Sisterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04817489284771105048noreply@blogger.com