tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post4975686477619133728..comments2024-02-22T02:15:01.912-08:00Comments on The Narcissistic Continuum: Mental Rumination: Why'd They Do That?CZBZhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comBlogger32125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-19959375377670658732015-06-10T17:22:15.003-07:002015-06-10T17:22:15.003-07:00You are living at home with a narcissistic parent?...You are living at home with a narcissistic parent? That can be excruciating, Kendrix. Once you are able to live on your own, you'll realize how competent you are. Daily life with narcissistic parents can grind down our confidence and ruin our self-esteem. The good thing is that we can "heal" and this is what I wish for you...that you are able to separate yourself from mistreatment and restore your self-esteem and worth. That you will be free to be yourself. It happens all the time. Have hope.<br /><br />Hugs,<br />CZCZBZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-38357881750485395292015-06-06T10:51:18.661-07:002015-06-06T10:51:18.661-07:00Sigh. So true. For a long time, my hatred & re...Sigh. So true. For a long time, my hatred & rejection of him was all I had to protect my identity & perception of reality from him - and now, the slightest thought of him pisses me off so much it exhausts me too much to do anythig productive, and I can't suceed because the thought that he'll pat himself on the shoulder for it disgusts me to such irrational degrees...<br /><br />My counsellor thinks moving out of the family home could help. I hope she's right... Kendrixhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03502596942918893445noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-45693169521897197582015-04-26T18:17:35.632-07:002015-04-26T18:17:35.632-07:00Oh! I didn't make the connection between "...Oh! I didn't make the connection between "Liselotte" and "anonymous"!! Well, my brain has been working overtime and isn't as quick as it used to be. It may take a day or two before I make the connection but I'll eventually get there. ha! <br /><br />I hope you're doing well and moving forward with your life and realizing how valuable you really are and that you don't need to put up with mistreatment by anyone!<br /><br />Hugs,<br />CZ<br /><br />CZBZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-2031614197569517152015-04-26T17:39:44.448-07:002015-04-26T17:39:44.448-07:00Such a great blog CZ, still !
;)
LiselotteSuch a great blog CZ, still !<br />;)<br />LiselotteAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-29416330822264442052015-04-26T15:06:56.554-07:002015-04-26T15:06:56.554-07:00Thank you for being here, anonymous! I hope that b...Thank you for being here, anonymous! I hope that by learning about narcissism, you will find the same peace and happiness as myself. <br /><br />Hugs,<br />CZCZBZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-42674945512123429542015-04-25T20:55:04.032-07:002015-04-25T20:55:04.032-07:00"Never expect them to have the same feelings ..."Never expect them to have the same feelings and expectations as I'd have, never expect the same rules I'd apply in human interaction.<br /><br />It's just not going to happen, in fact; I had the faulty assumptions that if you care for others, then they will care for you..."<br /><br />Dear Liselotte,<br /><br />Isn't that the truth? It's hard to accept the fact that some people do not value community, family or other people as much as they value themselves. But that's a fact. We've all met people who were obviously so self-invested that we'd never consider partnering with them or trusting them to care about anybody else.<br /><br />The problem that i see with narcissistic relationships is that the narcissist is highly adept at mirroring the other person (or partner) to such a degree that we falsely assume we SHARE the same values. We will SEE what the narcissist wants us to SEE""<br /><br />Yeah, they spend a while building a connection, but the second you step slightly out of line or speaking back (Expecting things of them) they start getting angry and passive aggressive and flat out cruel when it doesn't go there way. <br /><br /><br />LOVE Your blog, explains so many errors in my life and in my relationships. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-399126884219098642014-02-12T13:38:48.650-08:002014-02-12T13:38:48.650-08:00Oh! I see...you are living together as very good f...Oh! I see...you are living together as very good friends, not lovers! That helps me better understand your situation. It also explains why he isn't over-reacting to your discussions about NPD. He's a friend, not a "partner." He's interested in what you have to say about narcissism and his personality but he's doesn't feel as threatened as he might in an "intimate relationship." <br /><br />My guess is that as you change and grow and work through your issues, he will change, too. In fact, the whole relationship changes when ONE person stops behaving in patterned ways. Such as the BPD/NPD relationship when the narcissist pulls her strings to feel in control and she reacts. Once we stop reacting in the typical ways we always have, CHANGE takes place. It might be a healthy change and it might be MOVING to ANOTHER apartment, but some kind of change will happen. ha!<br /><br />I laughed out loud at your comment about not telling your partner he needed therapy! Oh yes! It is like sending narcissistic people to an electric chair! Their reaction can be painfully hostile which is curious to people who are only-too-happy to use psychological services. Therapy is a relief. It's a lot of work and tears and effort; but it IS relief learning healthier ways to relate to people (and ourselves).<br /><br />Hugs,<br />CZ<br /><br />CZBZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-29092835928425312662014-02-09T14:59:23.706-08:002014-02-09T14:59:23.706-08:00I forgot to mention he helps me to get a job and m...I forgot to mention he helps me to get a job and move out. I still call him my partner, but we are just very good friends.Flower budhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10138332132416334019noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-6019360040420628222014-02-09T14:53:03.254-08:002014-02-09T14:53:03.254-08:00Dear CZ,
Thank you for explaining again. After rea...Dear CZ,<br />Thank you for explaining again. After reading about narcissist over and over again it is for our kind still hard to really understand it. I don't know how much they know about NPD in Holland. I have learned about it, once I was in England and in Holland no one seemed to see his problem when I told about him. The psychologists even said I was still in the typical Borderline state of blaming other people. I still feel like the specialists of Borderline in Holland don't know enough about it. But that is my personal experience. <br />I do not think my friend is malignant. I also was/am training myself to understand more about it and it is not my intention to try to change him. But I was (and still am, because he is still trying to grow) confused when he made a move to do something about it. I think he really wants to, but he will not go in therapy for it. I have not mentioned therapy, because that would make him feel like I send him straight to the electric chair LOL. It just scares me when he seems to change. The harder he tries, the more the chance he bounces back, because I think he gets angry at himself it is not that easy. I am trying hard to get a job and move out. Until that time we have to cope with each other. And when I have a place of my own I can finally keep myself busy with my own problems. And than I will whine and complain about my mother 'wink` on your blog and keep on track with your stories and those of our blog-friends.<br />Thank you for your time and effort to explain BPD, NPD and MNPD in such a good way. I am trying not to insult him, but I think you understand that it is hard for me with my good will and 'understanding`(that is what makes him vomit, right?) to watch my words 'wink`, but I just keep trying to see it. I just have to read your comments on this over and over again, ha!<br /><br />Big hugs,<br />Flower bud<br />Flower budhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10138332132416334019noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-26105489914764489422014-02-05T14:12:30.241-08:002014-02-05T14:12:30.241-08:00You seem very motivated to work on yourself and ma...You seem very motivated to work on yourself and make changes that will improve your relationships with others (and yourself). But YOU are the one doing all the work and learning what your partner needs to know about himself. His disinterest in "his" issues is typical of narcissists. I think the best you can hope for in your relationship (unless he enters therapy) is that your educational and behavior changes will increase your resiliency and your self-worth in the event either of you decides to end the relationship. <br /><br />If it were me, I wouldn't involve him in my process. I wouldn't talk to him about "his" issues or threaten to leave if he didn't change. I'd go about my business improving my own life and working on my own issues without involving him. I would not keep 'tabs' on his behavior (unless writing privately about him in a journal, forum or blog). This is insulting to a narcissist as it is for anyone when someone else is judging their behavior on a good-bad scale. Practicing healthier boundaries between your process and his, will eliminate some of his defensive (and hurtful) behavior. <br /><br />We can tell someone how they've hurt us to establish a boundary and that's important. But we really have no right to tell others to change themselves to suit us. (this is something I am STILL learning, ha!) Basically, we can say that the relationship will not work if x, y and z continue to happen but then we leave it at that. They make the choice to honor our requests or not. If they won't (or can't) then we must remove ourselves from harm and end the relationship. It's a bitter pill to swallow when you love someone. <br /><br />I'm glad you're checking in with updates.... :-)<br /><br />Hugs<br />CZCZBZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-28153542984052767592014-02-05T14:06:17.184-08:002014-02-05T14:06:17.184-08:00Hi Flower bud,
In the USA, BPD and NPD are freque...Hi Flower bud,<br /><br />In the USA, BPD and NPD are frequently combined because of the significant overlap. I read a recent article about "borderline organization" suggesting it was easier to treat/cure BPD than NPD, even though "narcissists" appear to be more stable, confident, etc. That makes sense to me because people with borderline disorders WANT to have relationships. They VALUE relationships which supports their desire to change any behavior that hurts-or-limits relationships. <br /><br />Narcissists however, tend to be self-reliant, valuing their independence. Even though relationships are important to them, they are not as motivated to change themselves in order to maintain the relationship. Therapy/treatment is usually painful and most of us keep going anyway because we value relationships. We'd rather face our pain than lose a significant other. So that explains my view of NPD and BPD distinctions. <br /><br />The other thing to add is that Malignant Narcissism is more severe than NPD. There's the narcissistic personality disorder and if it overlaps with psychopathy, then it becomes Malignant Narcissism. Malignant narcissism is much rarer than NPD and it is distinguished by aggressive and sadistic behaviors, paranoid features, chronic suicidal behaviors, ambitious strivings for power and control, etc. I hope your partner is not a Malignant Narcissist because in that case, you may want to seriously consider ending the relationship as safely as possible. There is no cure for Malignant Narcissism. Check out my post at the top of my right column and scan through "the narcissism key" to read about malignant narcissism.<br /><br />As far as BPD healing on its own, I think that happens more times than people realize. It depends of course, on the severity of the disorder. Most women will see themselves in borderline traits, especially if they've suffered abusive relationships. It's more of a reaction (learned behavior) than a permanent trait based on psychological and emotional deficits. <br /><br />For awhile, women were being diagnosed with BPD at alarming rates but my impression is that this disorder is much better understood today than it was. A while ago, it was labeled the"garbage can diagnosis". An abusive relationship was causing the BPD behavior and s/he could eliminate dysfunctional behaviors once s/he learned about boundaries and/or ended the relationship. Is this how BPD and NPD are understood in your country?<br /><br />Healing NPD takes an average of seven years of intensive psychological treatment. If the person with a NPD is not being treated of his/her own free will, there's little to zero hope of cure. But what can and often does happen is that the narcissist adjusts his/her behavior to please their partner in order to preserve the relationship. So I guess if you consider cure to be permanent eradication of NPD-behaviors, then it will take years of consistent efforts on his part for that to happen. <br /><br />(to be continued)<br />CZBZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-60119725255473084902014-02-05T11:09:01.631-08:002014-02-05T11:09:01.631-08:00Hi CZ,
At the moment my N-friend is behaving reall...Hi CZ,<br />At the moment my N-friend is behaving really good for 2 weeks already. I know this can snap any moment and there are sometimes moments that I think 'There we go, he's back.` But than quickly he puts himself strait. I am almost thinking 'is he...changing?` I really appreciate it though. Now I can keep myself busy with other problems, like my N-mother for instant( I wasn't sure about her but now I know).<br />Now here is the thing; I will tell you honestly that I know for sure I have had Borderline (the psychologists said it and checking the symptoms I really did), but by some miracle I have only 2 or 3 traits left. So over a period of 10 years I kinda healed. I can tell you Borderline and Malignant Narcissism are close but not quite the same (for people who name the 2 traits together).<br />Now my N-friend acts like he understands things better lately and as if he is aware of what he is like. He said twice this week that he feels guilty how he has been acting towards me in the past. I do not dare to think that he is now actually healing but I answered to him that I don't dwell on the past when such thing stops happening and that I am proud of him that he starts to care about the effects of his behavior. Deep inside i am still careful. I have been through this many times before.<br />Today he gave me a kiss on my head,'just because he felt like it`. Later he walked in and out of the room (checking me)where I am working (and reading your blog). He could see I was on your blog again. I told him there are some things I have to get through to heal from. I have been through a hell with my ex-husbaNd and my mom on top of it (which is really true). I will wright about it one day, but the story is so bad and complicated I am now first reading all other peoples stories to give me the guts.<br />For the first time he was asking me about it (he hasn't cared for 3 years). He said he was glad I told him about it. He said that somehow he feels different lately since he is out of Holland and back in England. Again I reminded him it is not the country, because we are in GB for 3 month already and he is changed for 2 weeks.'It is not the country, it is all in your head!`,I said. He nodded,'that's true. But I do feel different somehow,`<br />Dear CZ, I so much want to believe this and yes, he is way softer lately and doesn't fall out anymore. He sometimes comes up with an advice that doesn't make any sense and gets annoyed when I don't want to follow them up, but I was glad enough he made some progress anyway. And now I am thinking; I am lately talking a lot about my recovery of Borderline and that is why I was thinking in the first place I could help him with the same traits he had and I recovered from myself by seeing it (he has a lot of times wondered why the hell I had chosen for him and this is my true answer). Back than I didn't know about Narcissism yet.<br />He finds it amazing that I went through all off this myself and that I think in such a mature manner.<br />Is he trying to copy me or is it possible he is really trying to change?<br />I am skeptical out of self-defense, but I don't show it to him. I find it way safer to know for sure he is a jerk anytime. It could be that he plays this healing game until I finally believe it and than bites me even harder than he ever has before. Or is he really...........sigh....<br />Flower budhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10138332132416334019noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-28549890110675190112013-09-05T14:47:22.340-07:002013-09-05T14:47:22.340-07:00This was so helpful. I've been trapped in thi...This was so helpful. I've been trapped in this hellish state for 2-3 years. Constantly wondering 'why?'. I've used the phrase 'not as advertised' to describe this person.<br /><br />I've wondered if, really, I'm the narcistic one. Everyone nasty thing I've let him do to me, he's accused me of, leaving me to spend so much energy defending myself against things that never happened. Only to learn, he was cheating, lying and backstabbing. <br /><br />Everyone thinks he's this great person, so thoughtful, helpful, softspoken. He's nothing like that.<br /><br />He lavished attention on me in the beginning. I was flattered. But, right away, anytime I trid to talk about something that was troubling me in my life, he would turn the conversation to himself, within a few sentences. It was puzzling and strange. He could never be there for me. He had an uncontrollable temper, and tantrums, like a child. I've never seen anything like it and there was someting always 'off' in the relationship. Now I know why.<br /><br />I don't think he really exists as a person. He's whoever he can make someone believe he is. Like skin or a shell. Eventually it cracks and the ugliness comes out. Then, he has to get a new person to make himself real. <br /><br />It's bizarre, it feels 'off' because you can't rationalize with the irrational. <br /><br />I'm going to stop ruminating (rationalizing the irrational) right now and reclaim myself. I've wasted too much trying to fix something that can't be. Thank You. DeeGeenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-51696936751277501932013-01-07T23:00:44.971-08:002013-01-07T23:00:44.971-08:00Yep. I'm still reading. I'm addicted to yo...Yep. I'm still reading. I'm addicted to your blog!<br /><br />Sorry...I was referring to the list of things about Mike:<br /><br />You wrote: “Here is an example of a basic memory process that I use in my class.” Dr. Campbell writes. “Start out by imagining a guy named Mike. Mike is a nice guy. Now I am going to list some of Mike’s behaviors:<br /><br />Mike bought his girlfriend flowers<br />Mike helps old ladies cross the street<br />Mike donates money to charity<br />Mike killed his cat<br />Mike volunteers to help the homeless<br />Mike dressed up as Santa Claus at Christmas<br /><br />My heart immediately went out to the cat. I have strong empathic feelings toward animals. I laughed though when you wrote that your thought was "Poor Mike." That's usually my next thought too, at least in 'real' life. But the subject being narcissism, well, there probably isn't a 'kind' explanation even though he'd lie and make one up. Ha! <br /><br />Your daughter probably had her immediate thought of psychopathy because she is aware of what you write about and your thought processes. No? LOL.<br /><br />I'm glad you enjoy my comments. I enjoy commenting. And I especially enjoy getting responses back. <br /><br />I wasn't married to the N that is now gone. In comparison to many here, our time together was pretty short (a couple years) but, it was long enough to get "hooked." And truthfully it became/turned into an unhappy 'place' for both of us. But the way it ended was truly traumatizing.<br /><br />The time factor aside and the fact we weren't married, doesn't seem to matter in the way I'm relating to so many of the things you write here in relating to a person like this. <br /><br />Much of your vocabulary and phrases are EXACTLY word for word things I've thought, said to myself and talked myself through. It's almost like someone else commented on another post that it's like you're in my mind...writing what I'm thinking. But then you go a step or two further and explain it, answer my questions. A serious breath of fresh air. <br /><br />I just shake my head at so many posts here, while thinking about how much of what you write resonates right to my core, in both the essays you write and the comments you and others add to it! <br /><br />The word uncanny comes to mind to describe similarities in experiences and behaviors, although it's sort of overused...uncanny.<br /><br />Anony AnnieAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-70967056930425861612013-01-07T21:01:15.694-08:002013-01-07T21:01:15.694-08:00It's so lovely reading your comments, Annie. I...It's so lovely reading your comments, Annie. I spent far too much time ruminating over "I shoulda done this, if only I'd done that." After awhile, you kinda feel like you're going crazy! It was seriously like having a computer virus in your brain and you can't boot up until its gone. <br /><br />Well, learning about NPD stopped that obsessive process. Suddenly everything clicked and I could move forward with my life. Which is WHAT we need to do since the narcissist has already gone. hahaha! But it's horrid and it's painful and it IS a relief when someone understands.<br /><br />Who leaves his wife and kids after spending decades with them? A narcissist, that's who! Normal people do NOT do the things narcissists are capable of doing.<br /><br />I'm not clear what Mike ran over if you're still reading comments and feel comfortable responding?<br /><br />Thank you so much for the validation, Annie. Feel free to comment anytime.<br /><br />Hugs,<br />CZCZBZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-52222843174777334112013-01-07T20:25:15.556-08:002013-01-07T20:25:15.556-08:00Oops...I didn't really finish that above thoug...Oops...I didn't really finish that above thought did I? <br />Basically what I was trying to say is that reading your essays gives me enough insight to be able to take a thought like "If I'd just been different...(in whatever way) he might still be here" and say, No, not necessarily. It wasn't ALL me. He has and will always have his own patterns that have nothing to do with me.<br /><br />Thanks again and hugs for you CZ<br />A. AnnieAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-66481470564456492782013-01-07T12:58:29.715-08:002013-01-07T12:58:29.715-08:00This is a rather old article, but being somewhat n...This is a rather old article, but being somewhat new around here, I'm clicking on links that catch my attention in your side bar. And since this one really hits home for me, I wanted to let you know I appreciate it.<br /><br />I think I've gotten the most insight on this site than any other. It really does help to understand logically and I'm beginning to connect emotions and intellect...slowly, but it's happening. The answer, "They do what they do because they're narcissists" has served to stop my circular train of thoughts many times. There is no real answer. My thought about Mike was, "Perhaps he ran over it, while backing out of the driveway. Or maybe he tripped, fell or otherwise dropped something on it by accident." <br /><br />But I found myself with those why questions A LOT. And it helps to find an article/essay that shows me what actually went on, what it was about. <br /><br />So thank you for explaining this as well as so many other things I've experienced. It's comforting to get the explanation...sort of. However I hate to say it's comforting to know others go through and have gone through it. Since it contradicts my empathy, it's confusing. I don't wish this state of confusion on anyone. <br /><br />It sucks that people have suffered so much as a result of a narcissists behavior, but if others didn't go through the very same things, especially those willing to share it in blogs such as this, we'd all be left sort of hanging onto our ruminations and wondering why we were left spinning and spiraling when all we wanted was to love and understand and be loved and understood in return.<br /><br />Your articles leave me with a feelings of waking up of sorts. Aha moments if you will. It sort of makes the thoughts about myself, which go something like, "If I'd just communicated differently, perhaps he'd still be here." <br /><br />Anonymous AnnieAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-17335444716131933832011-11-26T10:40:19.311-08:002011-11-26T10:40:19.311-08:00Sorry q1605! Sometimes the only solution is No Con...Sorry q1605! Sometimes the only solution is No Contact. It's a sad thing when families grow apart instead of together and I often wonder if 'narcissism' is at the root of the dysfunction. People seem to know that they cannot tolerate any interaction with a narcissistic parent even when they are unable to 'pinpoint' a mental disorder as the cause.<br /><br />I hope you and your sister are emotionally close with one another. Siblings can be a great comfort in a narcissistic family. I also read countless horror stories about siblings-turned-vampire and draining what life is left when the parents were done feeding. <br /><br />Vampire imagery works well with narcissists. Even before NPD was part of the DSM, narcissism was symbolized in mythology. Sometimes the only way to save yourself is to move away or say 'no' if she knocks on your door and begs entry.<br /><br />I am sorry for everything you and your sister have gone though. <br /><br />hugs,<br />CZCZBZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-91889285013126291422011-11-24T08:46:18.527-08:002011-11-24T08:46:18.527-08:00Man this is such a great post. I rationalized, min...Man this is such a great post. I rationalized, minimized, and justified my mothers behavior for almost 51 years. I have a sister and she was more of her scapegoat than I was. It was about a 51/49 split. But we have spent our lives just looking at each other and shrugging. She grew old and is alone. This was when she turned her full attention on us. Mainly me, because my sister moved far away a long time ago. <br />After all these years of just saying she is what she is and what can you do about it. I went NC and have been hit with a 50 year landslide of playing catch up. I run the same scenarios over and over in my head and just say WTF?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-19041426943960688792011-11-23T09:22:55.834-08:002011-11-23T09:22:55.834-08:00Excellent post. I really needed that.... I am in...Excellent post. I really needed that.... I am in the obsessing... ruminating.... drive yourself nutty phase over an EX-N. I long for a time where I can say, "Who cares?!"Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-46254744390217447742011-08-25T04:22:10.279-07:002011-08-25T04:22:10.279-07:00this is a great post. bang on. thank you.this is a great post. bang on. thank you.mossnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-56568569874842874702011-02-12T06:54:54.787-08:002011-02-12T06:54:54.787-08:00Hi CZ,
I've thought I ought to read some, giv...Hi CZ,<br /><br />I've thought I ought to read some, give myself a bit of a refresher, so I can keep myself out of harms way now and in the future.<br /><br />I still have days where I wonder why. I dislike those times the most. It is such an uncomfortable feeling. I enjoyed this essay. Your remark in your comments (in quotes below) is timely for me--<br /><br />"Yes! Absolutely! Who'd ruminate on someone who said they aspired to be an untrustworthy, abusive, cheatin', lying, arrogant, self-centered, pighead?"<br /><br />Exactly!<br /><br />Thanks CZ!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-74030976379805340562010-06-17T00:07:19.093-07:002010-06-17T00:07:19.093-07:00I am so grateful I found your writings and good co...I am so grateful I found your writings and good common sense. I am certain I was married to a malignant NPD. The confusion is that 1) he shot himself in the head when his horrific double life and secrets were exposed; and 2) I'm still trying to excavate the remains of my intelligence & WTF?!! from the bit-o-person left after a near decade of being sucked into his vacuum of a reality.<br /><br />In brief: I believed I had vanquished demons of a former Loser (my first child's biodad), when I met NPD friend at work. He was "genuine" "sincere" and so incredibly capable I *believed* (Ok, I'm an idiot many times over).<br /><br />On our honeymoon, the Mr. Hyde persona came out. Followed by sincere, begging Dr. Hyde apologies. Fast forward several years & a child conceived on wedding night, the only time I was treated humanely was when threatening separation. <br /><br />When he finally stopped raging at me, I sadly became warmer & more affectionate again toward him bc I was given the several months of "denying" the regular abuse. Turns out, he was indifferent by then due to his affair with his co-worker (who was pregnant).<br /><br />Faster forward, without suggestion, hint or reasonable explanation (short of blaming me), he up and had to leave us. Once out, he considered "reconciliation." DARN - I was diagnosed with Stage III breast cancer a month into our reconciling/renewed *dating*<br /><br />He was at least honest in that he said he would provide pragmatic support (buy groceries from a list I kept track of, drive the kids to school), he could not provide any emotional support. This part I was forced to take in only because others went out of their way to confirm I comprehended.<br /><br />Midway into my chemotherapy, his 18 month was revealed. His defense was to attack me by slamming my bald head onto a metal bedpost. Thank GOD our 5 yr old son and Nanny witnessed the entire event as he spent most of the following day when released from jail, trying to give his "version" (as he entitled it) to mutual friends.<br /><br />His transparent excuses finally destroyed, he gave up.<br /><br />I have a Ph.D. in molecular biology, a J.D. I was once a research professor, then high-technology patent attorney. I raised my daughter solo. She is now 16. <br /><br />What happened to me this past decade that has me ruminating and trying to make sense out of mental illness? <br /><br />That his final words to me after he slammed my head (as he was waiting for the police to arrive) were, "you-cunt-you-reap-what-you-sow..."<br /><br />Shouldn't that alone be enough for me to stop ruminating???<br /><br />It just leaves me feeling even more pathetic.<br /><br />Thank god I found your writings -Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-50188938768838925092009-11-07T13:54:12.033-08:002009-11-07T13:54:12.033-08:00"Never expect them to have the same feelings ..."Never expect them to have the same feelings and expectations as I'd have, never expect the same rules I'd apply in human interaction. <br /><br />It's just not going to happen, in fact; I had the faulty assumptions that if you care for others, then they will care for you..."<br /><br />Dear Liselotte,<br /><br />Isn't that the truth? It's hard to accept the fact that some people do not value community, family or other people as much as they value themselves. But that's a fact. We've all met people who were obviously so self-invested that we'd never consider partnering with them or trusting them to care about anybody else. <br /><br />The problem that i see with narcissistic relationships is that the narcissist is highly adept at mirroring the other person (or partner) to such a degree that we falsely assume we SHARE the same values. We will SEE what the narcissist wants us to SEE. <br /><br />Which means that if we are church-going, bible believing people, the narcissist will have a sudden conversion. Why not? Narcissists are accomplished actors and one role is as good as another as long as the Supply is adequate. <br /><br />If we are family-oriented and gift the narcissist with a good name and respect, then the narcissist will dot every 'i' and cross every 't' to make sure we SEE what we expect to SEE.<br /><br />Few people remain in narcissistic relationships once the N's cover has been blown. It may take awhile to stand firm in reality because we yearn for the person we believed him or her to be. The person THEY pretended to be.<br /><br />I never expected arrogant blowhards to reciprocate empathy and love. I wasn't trying to make someone he-or-she was not. My hope (as others have written) was to remain loyal to someone who professed a desire to embody the image they projected. <br /><br />I think it's important to remind ourselves that we weren't necessarily trying to FIX or CHANGE someone to please ourselves as much as narcissists proclaimed to be someone they were not. <br /><br />We had to work through our desire to support someone who was struggling (or so the N professed) and eventually accept the fact that whether the N was capable of change or not, he or she would not change. <br /><br /><br />"If trusting others to have your best interest at heart is one of your characteristics, you are leaving yourself open to disappointment, hurt, manipulation, and other dangers." ~Liselotte<br /><br />Absolutely! I am hoping that awareness of pathological behavior will protect us from making serious mistakes in our assumptions about human nature.<br /><br />I also believe that when we have moved through the initial grief and pain of our losses, we won't be as vulnerable to rejection. <br /><br />Some people erect steel walls to protect themselves from narcissists. I tend to believe (and hope) that a more realistic understanding of human nature coupled with a healing process that revisits old hurts and resolves them, is imperative. <br /><br />Big Hugs!<br />CZBZCZBZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09575206236892096611noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6801485432556979796.post-25533257578996051822009-11-06T20:07:17.413-08:002009-11-06T20:07:17.413-08:00'At a certain point it dawned on me that ya ca...'At a certain point it dawned on me that ya can't love anyone who doesn't want to be burdened by the responsibility it takes to care about another person as much as yourself.'<br /><br />Without wanting to sound paranoid:<br /><br />Never expect them to have the same feelings and expectations as I'd have, never expect the same rules I'd apply in human interaction. <br /><br />It's just not going to happen, in fact; I had the faulty assumptions that if you care for others, then they will care for you...<br /><br />What can you do? <br /><br />It could be helpful to give up the fantasy that if you care for someone, they will then care for you. It's nice when that happens, but letting go of the fantasy and expectations can give you a more realistic perspective... A little detachment and rational thought can do wonders. <br /> <br />If trusting others to have your best interest at heart is one of your characteristics, you are leaving yourself open to disappointment, hurt, manipulation, and other dangers.<br /><br />People with a destructive narcissistice personality have their personal needs as a top priority at all times. They are considerably self-absorbed, cannot imagine being any other way, and are convinced that everyone else is just as they are... If you are in a relationship with a manipulative destructive narcissist you have encountered your partner's cheating, lying, distorting and misleading. Your partner sees nothing wrong with these behaviors and attitudes, and is not about to change. Your confrontations and challenges do not work. You may be at the point where you are very frustrated, don't know what to believe or expect, and are at a a loss to know what to do about it. Talking out your concerns with your partner does not work. You really need to come to terms with the reality of your relationship and your partner's behaviors and attitudes. Your partner is unlikely to change. <br /><br />This is a hard concept to acknowledge and accept, but it is the reality!!!<br /><br />From The Destructive Narcissistic Pattern (N. Brown).<br /><br />Just wanted to share that with you :-) x<br /><br />LiselotteUnknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01434454757059074614noreply@blogger.com